Really interesting to see this perspective. BUT. It seems what is really missing from the discussion is the effect of gender identity ideology on the most disadvantaged children who end up in the care system, and are transitioned while in care. This is a race issue, as children in care are disproportionately non-white. It is also very different from the way gender ideology affects middle class children (mostly white, but including middle class black children of Nigerian immigrants like Nevline Nnaji). I think that Jonathan Haidt misses this other phenomenon, and it really needs a serious look.
Lois Cardinal (Duchess Louise of Alberta on Twitter) has pointed out that First Nations children in Canada are the most likely to be medically transitioned, because so many of them are in the care system, many have severe issues (histories of abuse etc) which lead to mental health problems that manifest in gender, and once you are in the care system, you are affirmed unquestioningly. (If you don't affirm, you cannot foster children.) Please can you do an episode on this issue. If Lois' claims are correct, it is a real social justice issue. Is it really true that Canada is sterilising indigenous children in the name of progress? In 2024?
From what I recall, in the hyper liberal spaces I was in, BLM became a thing after George Zimmerman was acquitted of the murder of Trayvon Martin in 2013. I remember hearing a black woman coined the term after Zimmerman's acquittal but I don't remember hearing anything about her being queer and wouldn't consider myself to be any sort of expert on the subject. It's strange to me that some people weren't aware of BLM until 2020 but I also think it goes to show the extent to which our bubbles influence what we see and hear about.
I do think a lot about why more people don't speak out against gender madness. I sort of feel that I had a front row seat to the emergence of the movement in fandom spaces even before Tumblr, back when LiveJournal was a thing. My sister was an early convert and believed strongly that lived experience is the only metric that matters and I had several debates with her about it, coming from an empirical, rational perspective, and there is something about this movement that is very good at making you feel like you're a horrible person for questioning it. This was 2009, 2010 before things got as crazy and entrenched as they did now and before you had the fears of losing your livelihood for one wrong move, but the moral authority people in this movement embody and how they weaponize it against anyone who asks a valid question is terrifying and hard to stand up against. I suspect the reason it's hard is because most people agree that everyone should be treated with respect and that sadly, sometimes because of immutable characteristics, they aren't. But then extremists take it to a place that most people can't follow and it's scary because people agree with the basic premise.
And in the case of trans ideology, the arguments are so obviously ridiculous and at times sexist that I think people's cognitive dissonance acts up, and that's not pleasant to feel, so they shut down rational thought on it.
Additionally, if there's one thing I've learned in the past 15 years, it is that people will follow the crowd and unfortunately true bravery is rare.
I've just started listening to this episode and had to comment that females going into male only spaces also changes the dynamic. Both sexes should have spaces that only their sex are allowed.
Thank you for this episode, it was so interesting !
I totally agree about the need for women-only sport's club. I discovered French boxing last year and absolutely loved it. But it was so frustrating to train with men who were better than me, not because they've been training for longer, had better technique or were just more talented, but because they're men. They are taller, stronger, faster, more powerful. I've been struggling with envying men's physical capacities since early teenagehood and it was really depressing for me to be confronted to it while doing something I was otherwise loving to do.
Really interesting to see this perspective. BUT. It seems what is really missing from the discussion is the effect of gender identity ideology on the most disadvantaged children who end up in the care system, and are transitioned while in care. This is a race issue, as children in care are disproportionately non-white. It is also very different from the way gender ideology affects middle class children (mostly white, but including middle class black children of Nigerian immigrants like Nevline Nnaji). I think that Jonathan Haidt misses this other phenomenon, and it really needs a serious look.
Lois Cardinal (Duchess Louise of Alberta on Twitter) has pointed out that First Nations children in Canada are the most likely to be medically transitioned, because so many of them are in the care system, many have severe issues (histories of abuse etc) which lead to mental health problems that manifest in gender, and once you are in the care system, you are affirmed unquestioningly. (If you don't affirm, you cannot foster children.) Please can you do an episode on this issue. If Lois' claims are correct, it is a real social justice issue. Is it really true that Canada is sterilising indigenous children in the name of progress? In 2024?
Thank you so much for raising these issues. We will definitely look into this.
From what I recall, in the hyper liberal spaces I was in, BLM became a thing after George Zimmerman was acquitted of the murder of Trayvon Martin in 2013. I remember hearing a black woman coined the term after Zimmerman's acquittal but I don't remember hearing anything about her being queer and wouldn't consider myself to be any sort of expert on the subject. It's strange to me that some people weren't aware of BLM until 2020 but I also think it goes to show the extent to which our bubbles influence what we see and hear about.
I do think a lot about why more people don't speak out against gender madness. I sort of feel that I had a front row seat to the emergence of the movement in fandom spaces even before Tumblr, back when LiveJournal was a thing. My sister was an early convert and believed strongly that lived experience is the only metric that matters and I had several debates with her about it, coming from an empirical, rational perspective, and there is something about this movement that is very good at making you feel like you're a horrible person for questioning it. This was 2009, 2010 before things got as crazy and entrenched as they did now and before you had the fears of losing your livelihood for one wrong move, but the moral authority people in this movement embody and how they weaponize it against anyone who asks a valid question is terrifying and hard to stand up against. I suspect the reason it's hard is because most people agree that everyone should be treated with respect and that sadly, sometimes because of immutable characteristics, they aren't. But then extremists take it to a place that most people can't follow and it's scary because people agree with the basic premise.
And in the case of trans ideology, the arguments are so obviously ridiculous and at times sexist that I think people's cognitive dissonance acts up, and that's not pleasant to feel, so they shut down rational thought on it.
Additionally, if there's one thing I've learned in the past 15 years, it is that people will follow the crowd and unfortunately true bravery is rare.
Keep up the good fight.
I've just started listening to this episode and had to comment that females going into male only spaces also changes the dynamic. Both sexes should have spaces that only their sex are allowed.
Thank you for this episode, it was so interesting !
I totally agree about the need for women-only sport's club. I discovered French boxing last year and absolutely loved it. But it was so frustrating to train with men who were better than me, not because they've been training for longer, had better technique or were just more talented, but because they're men. They are taller, stronger, faster, more powerful. I've been struggling with envying men's physical capacities since early teenagehood and it was really depressing for me to be confronted to it while doing something I was otherwise loving to do.